I am the Kat that Walks By Itself

and all places are alike to me

Who's Afraid of the Big Bad Wolf?

14th-Aug-2005 08:12 pm

Doctor Who: Bad Wolf/Parting of the Ways

Oh my oh my oh my! Talk about ending with a bang! I am going to miss the 9th Doctor terribly!

Transendence! Self-sacrifice! Everyman! Even though I'd been slightly spoiled for some bits of it, I was still sitting on the edge of my seat during "Parting of the Ways"

Cool things about Bad Wolf:

the sinking feeling when we find out that the actions in "The Long Game" actually made things worse.
"Where did you hide that?"
"You don't want to know."
The Doctor's complete unresponsiveness when he thought Rose was dead. Angst!
"My masters fear the Doctor" -- and that she dies happy because the Daleks are going to be destroyed because the Doctor is here.
The Doctor saying "No" at the end! (Yes!)

Cool things about Parting of the Ways:

The Daleks backing away from the Doctor because they feared him.
The "Weakest Link" android zapping three Daleks
"If I am god, what does that make you?"
Both the Doctor and Rose were willing to give up their life to save the other.
The Doctor chose not to "say the Deplorable Word"
The whole scene where Rose was saying that the Doctor had taught her how to stand up for what's right, say "no", take a stand.
The real reason for "Bad Wolf". I'm glad to say that that took me by surprise. When the Emperor Dalek said that "It was not of my design," it was a shivver down the spine: what, there's someone else out there?

There was a lot of fittingness here. That the Time War was ended through the intervention of Time. That transcendence occurs but briefly and has a huge cost. That "greater love hath no man than to lay down his life for a friend". And that it was mutual, and that it was that that saved the day. That it was the ordinary people who made a difference, not just the "professional heros". That all the losers were on Floor Zero. That actions have consequences. That the end doesn't justify the means.

And the trancendence... Deus-Ex-Machina literally! Was it Rose or the TARDIS together with Rose? Because there were some bits where it felt like both of them. But they better not ever use that again, because, like, it would get old, and that would spoil everything. Though it was fascinating with the "I can feel the past, future, all that could be" and "I can too!" for three reasons: (1) it harks back to the bit in "Rose" where the Doctor says he can see the world turning; (2) it's another odd-and-alien thing about the Doctor (which they can't give us too many of, because then one gets into the problem of "he's a superhero, why doesn't he use his powers?", and we don't want the Doctor to be a superhero, just a slightly trancendent hero; (3) one wonders if Rose will retain anything from the experience, whether she will become more the Doctor's equal.

I'm gonna miss the 9th Doctor!

I wonder if the Dalek in "Dalek" was a new-style Dalek or an original? Actually I think it was an original, because (a) it wasn't afraid of the Doctor (b) it used the customary Dalek greeting ("You are the Doctor! You are an enemy of the Daleks! You must be exterminated!") (c) it didn't know what had happened to the Dalek fleet at the end of the Time War.

Tags:fandom, fandom:drwho
Mood:enthralled
Music:Cliff Richard / Some People

Comments

14th-Aug-2005 10:41 am (UTC)

hawkeye7

That it was the ordinary people who made a difference, not just the "professional heros"

That was pretty much the theme of the whole series...

14th-Aug-2005 10:50 am (UTC)

kerravonsen

That was pretty much the theme of the whole series...
Yeah, well it certainly did keep on recurring -- Gwynneth in "The Unquiet Dead", Nancy in "The Doctor Dances", Cathia in "The Long Game"; I'm not sure whether Harriet Jones in "Aliens Of London/World War Three" counts, as she is a Member of Parliament, though an "ordinary person" in that she's a backbencher...

And of course Micky and Jackie. Which is very unusual for Who, in having recurring non-companion characters stuck on Earth when the TARDIS isn't stuck on Earth...

Some other odd and interesting themes: why is it that all his enemies keep on calling the Doctor a coward? It wasn't just the Daleks, or the Dalek in "Dalek", I think there was at least one other occassion... didn't the Nestine consciousness call him a coward too? And of course the thing raised with that is: is one a coward if one choses not to utterly destroy one's enemies?

14th-Aug-2005 10:58 am (UTC)

lady_smith

My theory on the whole "coward" thing is that it has something to do with why he survived the time way - maybe that he stayed out of it untill the last possible seccond and THEN landed the decisive blow?

14th-Aug-2005 11:04 am (UTC)

kerravonsen

My suspicion is that he'd been trying to be a peacemaker -- trying to stop the war, and therefore he was a "coward" for not participating.

Thing is, from what he said in "Dalek", he didn't think he should have survived -- and I don't mean survivor's guilt, I mean, that he didn't think he would have survived whatever he did.

Though the interesting thing in "Parting of the Ways" was the remark which implied that the Time Lords themselves thought that dying in order to destroy the Daleks was something worth doing -- in other words, that the whatever-it-was that caused the Burning, was something done with the cooperation of the Time Lords, not something that the Doctor did off his own bat, though from what was said in "Dalek", it does seem that his was the hand that actually struck the blow.

It's all very fascinating, these hints...

14th-Aug-2005 11:47 pm (UTC)

lady_smith

I concur with the facinatingness of the hints, yes. I do love a series wih an unfolding mystery...

I think you hit it on the head with the idea that he really SHOULDN'T have survived - it's an inexplicable mystery, even to him.

14th-Aug-2005 03:36 pm (UTC)

redstarrobot

When the Emperor Dalek said that "It was not of my design," it was a shivver down the spine: what, there's someone else out there?

I'd like to think that's the case, but I suspect the answer is that "Bad Wolf" began and ended with Rose; she named the company that to know she had to go back. It just didn't feel very concluded to me. I confess that while I enjoyed that final climactic moment with Glowy!Rose, part of me also found it sort of painful, and I'd like to think there's more to it.

I think the Dalek must have been old-style. It fell to Earth during the Time War, and all these new Daleks are long post-Time-War. And the issue of contamination by human cells was new to it.

14th-Aug-2005 09:30 pm (UTC)

kerravonsen

but I suspect the answer is that "Bad Wolf" began and ended with Rose;

Oh, I know that, but at the point in the episode at which that bit of dialogue happened, we didn't know that -- that's why the shivver. That we find out later in the episode that BadWolf was Glowy!Rose makes sense, but it wasn't something that I anticipated, because I had managed to avoid that particular spoiler. I knew from spoilers that Rose had had an Encounter with the Time Vortex and that the Doctor died saving her from that, but I'd kind of assumed that it was an Instant!Death encounter, rather than a Godlike!Powers encounter. So I was very glad to be surprised about it.

It fell to Earth during the Time War,
That was an assumption on the Doctor's part, though. Because it was a Time War, there wasn't anything about that particular space and time that would have given more or less weight to that Dalek being a survivor of the Time War, because if it had been a survivor, the Dalek could have ended up anywhere in space and time, presumably. Wheras if it has been a descendent of a survivor of the Time War, the same anywhere-in-space-and-time could also have applied.

And the issue of contamination by human cells was new to it.

True. Which makes me wonder what would have happened in an AU universe where the Dalek had been persuaded not to kill itself, become a companion (as I know some people wanted) and then been with them when they encountered these faux-Daleks. Would its old programming of obedience to the Emperor Dalek have kicked in? Would it have been horrified by the faux-Daleks and wanted to exterminate them? Would it have been horrified by the Emperor-Worship and tried to exterminate the Emperor? (Is there a "you are defective" exterminate-the-Emperor clause in Dalek programming?)

14th-Aug-2005 05:22 pm (UTC)

astrogirl2

Was it Rose or the TARDIS together with Rose?

I've just been discussing this point, sort of, because it's relevant to something I'm writing. Personally, I very much beleive it's the latter. (Which makes that "my Doctor" incredibly sweet and poignant to me.)

14th-Aug-2005 08:12 pm (UTC)

kalypso_v

I have my own theory about the Dalek in "Dalek". But leaving that aside, I think it's pretty clear it's an old-style Dalek straight from the Time War.

I've only noticed during the current re-runs that Rose complains about the Tardis's telepathic interference inside her head in "The End of the World".

14th-Aug-2005 09:55 pm (UTC)

kerravonsen

It's an interesting theory, but it depends on how flexible Dalek programming is: can a footsoldier Dalek declare itself Emperor? I can't remember enough about Emperor Daleks in general. Is there a Dalek equivalent of Royal Jelly? On the other hand, one could certainly argue that the van Statten Dalek could have been driven so insane that overcoming its programming and declaring itself God wouldn't be that unlikely.

Do we know when the Emperor Dalek arrived on the scene? How many years did it say that it had been hatching its plans? Presumably it was behind the Jagravoth (sp?) on Sattelite 5 in The Long Game, but that's thousands of years into the future from the time of "Dalek". If the van Statten Dalek is a different Dalek, did it fail to detect the existance of other Daleks because there weren't any there yet (because the Emperor Dalek arrived at a later time) or because they were so deeply in hiding that even the van Statten Dalek couldn't detect them or raise them on its Classified Dalek Emergency Protocols?

And did the Emperor Dalek survive by itself, or did it have a ship which it then used as a template to build the other ships?

As for why the Daleks delayed, it was clear that they were so frightened of the Doctor that they wanted to make Really Sure that their plans worked this time. Which I think is another argument against the van Statten Dalek being the Emperor Dalek, because the only person that the faux-Daleks could have learned such fear from would be the Emperor Dalek itself -- and if the van Statten Dalek is the Emperor Dalek, it wouldn't have the same reason to fear the Doctor, because in running away rather than dying, it's just gone and tricked the infamous Doctor, which would give it more confidence rather than less.

On the other hand, there is that seemingly personal interest that the Emperor Dalek has in watching the Doctor becoming the Great Exterminator, which is, indeed, spookily reminiscent of the exchanges the Doctor had with the van Statten Dalek where it asserted that they were alike.

22nd-Aug-2005 02:04 am (UTC)

kalypso_v

I waited to answer this, as I knew we were due to see Dalek again today in the BBC3 reruns.

I see no reason to doubt the Dalek's statement that it's a soldier bred to receive orders, but its position is unique and I think it's capable of adapting. Even before its encounter with Rose, it seems to be emotionally savvy; it understands exactly how to needle the Doctor, and later how to manipulate Rose into touching it. Maybe half a century in captivity on Earth has given it some sort of insight into human behaviour, even if it's been the brutal end of human behaviour.

And then there's the transformation effected through Rose... I still have difficulty swallowing the explanation, but if we're to accept that it absorbs emotion through Rose, I don't see why it shouldn't absorb something of her independent spirit. Plus it's downloaded the internet and "knows everything".

And it's just learned through the Doctor that it is the sole survivor of its race, so if it does survive its apparent suicide it may feel it is the Emperor by default, and has a duty to recreate the Daleks from scratch, even if it takes 20,000 years. (To answer your question, if the Emperor is a completely different Dalek, I don't think it's lurking around Earth undetected in 2012, I think it arrives later.)

I don't think we have to accept that the van Statten Dalek is redeemed by Rose, or has any real chance of coming to terms with its human emotions. It explicitly rejects its mutation - "I shall not be like you!" - and then there's the bizarre command to Rose: "Order my destruction! Obey! Obey!" It has already moved from awaiting orders to giving them, even if they are, paradoxically, a final attempt to get someone else to take charge.

Maybe it really does commit suicide. Or maybe it intends to, and survives through a freak accident. If so, it has 20,000 years to think about its purpose, plan its strategy, and start to carry it out. (And I'm not clear how long a Dalek can live; if its lifespan is limited, it's possible that the Emperor who challenges the Doctor is a "descendant", in the sense of one in a line created by the van Statten Dalek, and gradually bred to adopt an imperial stance.)

I'm not sure that the van Statten Dalek wouldn't fear the Doctor, especially when he's boasted to it that he destroyed the entire Dalek race, and then become associated, however unintentionally, with the new threat of contamination through humanity.

As you say, there are striking similarities between the vSDalek-Doctor and Emperor Dalek-Doctor exchanges - both accuse him of cowardice, and both highlight their potential likeness. And another reason why I like the van Statten-Emperor link is the same thing that you have mentioned: "the sinking feeling when we find out that the actions in "The Long Game" actually made things worse."

22nd-Aug-2005 04:07 am (UTC)

kerravonsen

Even before its encounter with Rose, it seems to be emotionally savvy; it understands exactly how to needle the Doctor, and later how to manipulate Rose into touching it. Maybe half a century in captivity on Earth has given it some sort of insight into human behaviour, even if it's been the brutal end of human behaviour.

It's a bit hard to suss out Daleks sometimes, because, even though they're quite logical, they have been capable of being quite manipulative, at least as far as duping people if it was part of their schemes.

But this one does certainly seem to have particular insight into the Doctor (not to mention that line "What good are emotions if you cannot save the woman you love?")

The thing with Rose, though... I'm not sure that that was mere manipulation. One could interpret it either way, I suppose. If one wishes to believe it redeemed (or have now a greater potential for redemption, at least) then one is inclined to consider it to be sincere.

On the other flipper, if Daleks, all Daleks, are always unredeemably evil, then of course it was just being manipulative.

I'm not sure that the van Statten Dalek wouldn't fear the Doctor, especially when he's boasted to it that he destroyed the entire Dalek race

True. That is a point.

22nd-Aug-2005 11:45 am (UTC)

kalypso_v

I'm not sure I'd say they're irredeemably evil; they're working from a completely different set of principles. Even the Doctor, who's about as anti-Dalek as he can be in this episode, states that "A Dalek is honest. It does what it was born to do for the survival of its species." The supremacy of the Daleks is the supreme good for a Dalek.

(While googling for the precise wording of that quote, I stumbled on this website which suggests using clips from the episode with students to explore the differences between the Dalek's/van Statten's/a Christian worldview.)

22nd-Aug-2005 12:18 pm (UTC)

kerravonsen

Intriguing page.

One of the questions raised on that page... why does the Doctor consider that the Dalek is better than van Statten?
The Dalek is honest, that is the virtue which is cited.
Wheras van Statten is not honest; he is decieving himself, because he says that he is (a) reaching for the stars and (b) benefiting mankind, when in fact he is doing neither; he is caging the stars in the mud, and he is only benefiting himself.

One could argue that the evil of the Daleks actually is rooted in taking one virtue (love of one's family/race/nation) and elevating it above all others. A Dalek is honest because it sticks to this one virtue without deviation, fanatically.
Wheras the Doctor was showing up van Statten's hypocracy.

But, really, is hypocracy a worse sin than genocide?
Though, I think, in one sense, the Doctor's statement implies that... Daleks are like wild beasts, without concience, with no choice in their actions; they were born to exterminate, that they can't help it, that they aren't capable of making the same kind of moral choices that human beings (such as van Statten) can; in other words, that van Statten is worse than the Dalek because he knows better.

22nd-Aug-2005 01:09 pm (UTC)

kalypso_v

Van Statten does show himself ready to sacrifice unlimited numbers of his own kind as long as his own survival is guaranteed. Goddard says 200 have died, and van Statten is finally swayed by the threat to his own life, not to the entire population of Salt Lake City. So perhaps the Doctor senses that van Statten is as capable of genocide - even of his own race - as the Dalek, he's just less honest in admitting it. So he's worse because he combines genocide and hypocrisy.

I was one of those who would have liked the Dalek as a Companion, or at any rate a temporary alliance between Doctor and Dalek to escape van Statten's clutches before they resumed their own duel. But I suppose, apart from his previous history making it impossible to work with a Dalek, the Doctor's thought is that the Dalek's personal potential for destruction is greater than van Statten's, in the immediate future at least, and therefore it must be stopped at all costs, even if that means a temporary alliance with van Statten before resuming that duel.

Though I did also toy with the idea that the Emperor could originally have been van Statten, in a peculiar result of his mindwipe, or Adam, who has connections with both the Dalek and Satellite Five. Haven't worked those out in detail though.

22nd-Aug-2005 02:18 pm (UTC)

kerravonsen

I was one of those who would have liked the Dalek as a Companion, or at any rate a temporary alliance between Doctor and Dalek to escape van Statten's clutches before they resumed their own duel.

I agree that the Doctor's previous history would make it impossible for him to work with a Dalek, but the idea did intrigue me when I saw it in a comment on a Who post in somebody's LJ (and maybe it was a comment by you in

astrogirl2's LJ, but it's too much work to track it down). And looking at a few of your Who posts just now, I see you didn't like the dea-ex-machina of Parting of the Ways either. I can see why you didn't like it, yet at the same time, I was caught up in the drama and angst and wonder of it all; I did like it. I liked the thematic resonance of it, the contrast between the "false god" of the Emperor Dalek, and the "angel" of Rose. Transcendence versus corruption.

However, it may be thanks to you that I'm now currently writing a Bad-Wolf-less AU, inspired by somebody's remark that it would have been much more interesting if Rose had spent years figuring out how to fly the TARDIS... Well, perhaps "interesting" is not the word; the word is probably "challenging". In more than one sense.

Dang it, it's after midnight. That's what I get for trying to transcribe more bits of "Parting of the Ways".

22nd-Aug-2005 02:53 pm (UTC)

kalypso_v

I'm now currently writing a Bad-Wolf-less AU

Some good comes of all things!

Thinking about it over lunch, I saw another connection between "Dalek" and "Parting of the Ways" - the Doctor tells Rose the Daleks mustn't get their hands, er, plungers on the Tardis technology. Likewise, having discovered that van Statten's basically an asset-stripper, he wouldn't want van Statten to get his hands on Dalek technology, which would greatly increase his capacity for destruction.

I also came up with a theory that the Doctor accusing van Statten of being worse than a Dalek was in part a reaction to being told he'd make a good Dalek himself ("maybe I'm bad, but he's worse"). Unfortunately, though I haven't played the tape back to check, the various online synopses suggest the quotes occur in the wrong order for that to work. Oh well.

14th-Aug-2005 10:03 pm (UTC)

kerravonsen

I've only noticed during the current re-runs that Rose complains about the Tardis's telepathic interference inside her head in "The End of the World".

You think that's Significant, do you?

14th-Aug-2005 11:54 pm (UTC)

kalypso_v

I think it's Foreshadowing.

15th-Aug-2005 12:59 am (UTC)

kerravonsen

But it wasn't as if she noticed it; she didn't know it was happening until the Doctor told her about it, and then she complained about it. True, it was Something Important To Know, but it wasn't a new piece of continuity (we'd known about that ability of the TARDIS since Masque of Mandragora). If anything, all it tells us is how much Rose has grown, that coming from a point where she dislikes the idea of the TARDIS messing with her mind, she's willing to try for telepathic communication with the TARDIS in order to convince it to go back to rescue the Doctor.

22nd-Aug-2005 02:15 am (UTC)

kalypso_v

I think you must be understanding "foreshadowing" in a different sense from me; that's precisely what I mean. Rose moves from being shocked to find the Tardis has interfered with her mind to a point where she actively seeks telepathic bonding, and since Russell T. Davies wrote both episodes I think he had the end of the plot arc in mind when he wrote the lines in "The End of the World". Though I don't believe it has to be planned like that to count as foreshadowing; I would argue that Vila's suggestion in Cygnus Alpha that the prisoners should kill the cold-hearted murdering Avon before he has them dumped out of an airlock is a delicious instance, and I'm sure that its connection with events of the late fourth season is entirely accidental.

15th-Aug-2005 09:41 am (UTC)

hawkeye7

This episode also contains the answer to your question a few weeks back... Rose remembers the changed timeline, rememberds her mother telling her about the blonde woman holding her father's hand.

15th-Aug-2005 09:57 am (UTC)

kerravonsen

True. Doesn't necessarily mean that she doesn't remember both versions.

Leave a Comment to the Entry

This page was loaded Jul 10th 2009, 7:19 am GMT.